Condemned why?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Shepherd

Shepherd

Active member
#1
May 11, 2022
268
88
28
#1
John 3:16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. 18He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

A warden of a prison decided to pardon everyone in the prison simply for saying "yes". Those who didn't say "yes" at the end of the day, would die when he had the place burned to the ground. So he went about sending letters of warnings to a few select inmates of his own choosing, and the warnings simply read: "whisper 'yes' to the warden when he walks past your cell". But the ones the warden had not chosen simply didnt get the letter.

At the end of the day all of the chosen ones had said "yes" and were freed from their cells and released from the prison. Then the warden sent out an announcement: "Ok, we are burning the prison down, all of you will die because you failed to say "yes".

The warden just LIED. Because the real reason they all will die, is because he never sent them the letter. Likewise, it's the same with Calvinistic theology.
But God says you're condemned because YOU failed to believe, not because God decided not to "enable you" to believe.
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#4
Jul 3, 2015
65,070
33,173
113
#4
Shepherd said:
Well, then Calvinism has to be a lie of the devil.
Click to expand...
I can't say for certain what you mean when you say Calvinism because it seems there are quite a few different definitions of it floating around here among various members, some of whom surely do seem to have what is called CDS.
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#5
Jul 3, 2015
65,070
33,173
113
#5
It does seem what you are addressing largely is man's inability, but that is not exclusive to Calvinism, since Arminianism and also Molinism also teach it... Scripture affirms it and so does Jesus.
 
T

timf

Member
#6
Jul 7, 2022
34
17
8
#6
One confusing thing about Calvinism is the English words elect and predestined. It might help to consider the elect as those who chose to accept an invitation extended to all. By making this choice, they gain entrance into a category that had been predetermined that some would occupy.

It can be tempting to consider ourselves the object Of God's full attention, however, we are warned against the danger of thinking too highly of ourselves;

Rom 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
 
NightTwister

NightTwister

Well-known member
#7
Jul 5, 2023
2,442
942
113
66
Colorado, USA
#7
Shepherd said:
John 3:16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. 18He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

A warden of a prison decided to pardon everyone in the prison simply for saying "yes". Those who didn't say "yes" at the end of the day, would die when he had the place burned to the ground. So he went about sending letters of warnings to a few select inmates of his own choosing, and the warnings simply read: "whisper 'yes' to the warden when he walks past your cell". But the ones the warden had not chosen simply didnt get the letter.

At the end of the day all of the chosen ones had said "yes" and were freed from their cells and released from the prison. Then the warden sent out an announcement: "Ok, we are burning the prison down, all of you will die because you failed to say "yes".

The warden just LIED. Because the real reason they all will die, is because he never sent them the letter. Likewise, it's the same with Calvinistic theology.
But God says you're condemned because YOU failed to believe, not because God decided not to "enable you" to believe.
Click to expand...
LOL no.
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#8
Jul 3, 2015
65,070
33,173
113
#8
timf said:
One confusing thing about Calvinism is the English words elect and predestined. It might help to consider the elect as those who chose to accept an invitation extended to all. By making this choice, they gain entrance into a category that had been predetermined that some would occupy.
Click to expand...

From 1 Peter 1 verses 3-5 ~ The elect are chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father and sanctified by the Spirit for obedience to Jesus Christ and sprinkling by His blood. By His great mercy He has given us new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, and into an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, reserved in heaven for you, who through faith are shielded by God’s power for the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#9
Jul 3, 2015
65,070
33,173
113
#9
timf said:
One confusing thing about Calvinism is the English words elect and predestined. It might help to consider the elect as those who chose to accept an invitation extended to all. By making this choice, they gain entrance into a category that had been predetermined that some would occupy.
Click to expand...

From Ephesians 1 verses 4-6 ~ He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world to be holy and blameless in His presence. In love He predestined us for adoption as His sons through Jesus Christ, according to the good pleasure of His will, to the praise of His glorious grace, which He has freely given us in the Beloved One.
:)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.