Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[HeIsHere]

They are already without excuse, according to Romans 1.
I believe men fit themselves for destruction as per Romans 9. I believe this would be true of everyone if God did not purpose otherwise.

Is that destruction "hell" ... probably not.

 

[Cameron143]

There will never really be a dialogue, all we can do is point out all the holes in the schema by scripture and logic.
It is not possible to dialogue with what is essentially illogical, even of you pull scripture to make it sound Biblical

As @cv5 has pointed out many times,

God doesn’t program people’s decisions like robots
He wants people to Love Him/Seek Him by their own decision – without making that decision for them.

He/God proposes marriage to her – and honors her decision – and does not make her decision for her.
He/God allows her to say no – and does not determine her choice.

What I see in this Reformed School is the case of the irresistible bull of Greek mythology.

So, more ignoring the questions that I am interested in, and more blather and pontificating. This is why having the discussion is impossible.
Grace and peace.

 

[Magenta]

God doesn’t program people’s decisions like robots
He wants people to Love Him/Seek Him by their own decision – without making that decision for them.

Too funny, as if God does not know those whose hearts are uncircumcised cannot love Him. Try reading Deuteronomy 30:6, Ezekiel 11:19, and this also: I will give them one heart and one way, so that they will always fear Me for their own good and for the good of their children after them. I will make an everlasting covenant with them: I will never turn away from doing good to them, and I will put My fear in their hearts, so that they will never turn away from Me. Yes, I will rejoice in doing them good.

 

[Magenta]

Is that destruction "hell" ... probably not.

Do you not make a distinction between the improperly translated word "hell" and the Lake of Fire?

I would not be surprised if you did not.

 

[HeIsHere]

So, more ignoring the questions that I am interested in, and more blather and pontificating. This is why having the discussion is impossible.
Grace and peace.

Why would I discuss a doctrine most people are realizing on a daily basis is outside scripture, the right thing to do is show its errors.

 

[Magenta]

Why would I discuss a doctrine most people are realizing on a daily basis is outside scripture, the right thing to do is show its errors.

You have zero verses articulating free will of the natural man. Stop lying.

There are plenty showing God acts firsts and draws man to cause him to repent and obey.

The natural man is incapable of obeying. But you deny this and much else said of the natural man.

You have to so you can cling to your false doctrine which you prefer above what Scripture explicitly articulates.

 

[Magenta]

I don't need to know God's purpose to know that when He sends forth His word that it will always accomplish what He purposes. His
word clearly says that it does. My question to you is...when God sends forth His word, is the purpose always to accomplish salvation?

The LORD of Hosts has sworn: “Surely, as I have planned, so will it be; as I have purposed, so will it stand.” Isaiah 14 verse 24 The counsel of the LORD stands forever, the purposes of His heart to all generations. Psalm 33 verse 11 Our God is in heaven; He does as He pleases. Psalm 115 verse 3 Many plans are in a man’s heart, but the purpose of the LORD will prevail. Proverbs 19 verse 21 In Him we were also chosen as God’s own, having been predestined according to the plan of Him who works out everything by the counsel of His will. Ephesians 1 verse 11 And we know that God works all things together for the good of those who love Him, who are called according to His purpose. For those God foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brothers. And those He predestined, He also called; those He called, He also justified; those He justified, He also glorified. Romans 8 verses 28-30 For He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world to be holy and blameless in His presence. In love He predestined us for adoption as His sons through Jesus Christ, according to the good pleasure of His will. Ephesians 1 verses 4-5

 

[HeIsHere]

Just to be clear what Reformed Doctrine teaches...

The doctrine of reprobation, in Christian theology, particularly within Reformed theology, refers to God's eternal, unconditional decision to pass over certain individuals and not grant them salvation, instead leaving them to experience the consequences of their sin. It's the negative counterpart to the doctrine of election, where God chooses some for salvation.

Essentially, reprobation means God does not choose to save some individuals, not because of any inherent fault in them, but because of his sovereign will.
Gemini/

 

[Magenta]

John 3 verse 6, Romans 8 verse 7, Galatians 5 verse 17, 2 Timothy 3 verse 13, Romans 3 verse 18 ~ Flesh is born of flesh, but spirit is born of the Spirit. The mind of the flesh is hostile to God: It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. The flesh craves what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are opposed to each other. Evil men and imposters go from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived. There is no fear of God before their eyes.

 

[Cameron143]

Why would I discuss a doctrine most people are realizing on a daily basis is outside scripture, the right thing to do is show its errors.

What you are actually doing is refusing to acknowledge scripture. I didn't address you with my views. I gave scripture and asked questions. Rather than stay on point and explore the implications of scripture, you go off point and spout things that aren't germane to the passage. And that because you aren't actually interested in truth, but hanging on to your current beliefs. Anything that might actually show error in your thinking requires a change of subject and a general denunciation of the other view. It's your modus operandi, and that of many here.

 

[Cameron143]

Just to be clear what Reformed Doctrine teaches...

The doctrine of reprobation, in Christian theology, particularly within Reformed theology, refers to God's eternal, unconditional decision to pass over certain individuals and not grant them salvation, instead leaving them to experience the consequences of their sin. It's the negative counterpart to the doctrine of election, where God chooses some for salvation.

Essentially, reprobation means God does not choose to save some individuals, not because of any inherent fault in them, but because of his sovereign will.
Gemini/

Have you ever objected to God choosing Israel to the neglect of every other nation? Do you object to God sovereignly passing over every other nation?

 

[HeIsHere]

Have you ever objected to God choosing Israel to the neglect of every other nation? Do you object to God sovereignly passing over every other nation?

He didn't.

 

[Magenta]

from Ephesians 4 verses 17-19 ~ Gentiles walk in the futility of their thinking. They are darkened in their understanding and alienated from the life of God because of the ignorance that is in them due to the hardness of their hearts. Having lost all sense of shame, they have given themselves over to sensuality for the practice of every kind of impurity, with a craving for more.

 

[cv5]

Have you ever objected to God choosing Israel to the neglect of every other nation? Do you object to God sovereignly passing over every other nation?

Choosing Israel? Right. To do what exactly?

Do you know? I doubt it.

 

[Cameron143]

He didn't.

That's interesting. What other nation does the Bible refer to as God's people? In Deuteronomy 7:6-8, God says He chose Israel. Do you find in scripture God doing so for another nation?

 

[Cameron143]

Choosing Israel? Right. To do what exactly?

Do you know? I doubt it.

So...God did choose Israel? @HeIsHere is incorrect? Did God choose any other nation? Did God force Israel to be His people?

 

[Rufus]

With a Determinist foundation of course.

And your point is??? God clearly determined to save Eve in Gen 3:15, didn't he? And he determined to make Pharaoh a hardened reprobate, didn't He? And He was determined to not only prohibit Balaam from cursing Israel but "forced" him to bless His people, didn't He?

Will you ever seek a cure for your blindness?

 

[Rufus]

So...God did choose Israel? @HeIsHere is incorrect? Did God choose any other nation? Did God force Israel to be His people?

God might have whacked them hard upside the head. That could have been one way to intimidate them.

 

[cv5]

So...God did choose Israel? @HeIsHere is incorrect? Did God choose any other nation? Did God force Israel to be His people?

Choosing Israel? Right. To do what exactly?

Do you know? Evidently not.

And that fact that you do not is part and parcel of your abject failure to rightly comprehend the God of Salvation.

 

[Rufus]

and who is given to God?

is it not those who see and believe?

do he himself say those who do have PASSED from death to life (bron again or regeneration)

and that they shall not be judged?

John 5: 24 “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.

The elect! Who else. See Rom 8:29:30.