Understanding God’s election
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This last part is such a feeble argument. Please consider setting it aside. It would be of benefit to us all, including you, if you would do so.
So I wouldn't have to think or work too hard to ponder the fallacies involved, I followed @Inquisitor and asked AI - CoPilot so credit where credit is due:
Query: fallacious argument that says it's pride to choose to accept one's need for grace
Ah, yes—this is a subtle but significant misstep in reasoning that often masquerades as piety. The argument typically goes something like: “If you choose to accept grace, then you’re taking credit for your salvation, which is prideful. Therefore, true humility means you can’t choose—it must be entirely imposed or irresistible.” But this line of thought is riddled with fallacies.
Here’s a breakdown of the fallacious reasoning involved:
🧠 1. False Dilemma (Either/Or Fallacy)
So I wouldn't have to think or work too hard to ponder the fallacies involved, I followed @Inquisitor and asked AI - CoPilot so credit where credit is due:
Query: fallacious argument that says it's pride to choose to accept one's need for grace
Ah, yes—this is a subtle but significant misstep in reasoning that often masquerades as piety. The argument typically goes something like: “If you choose to accept grace, then you’re taking credit for your salvation, which is prideful. Therefore, true humility means you can’t choose—it must be entirely imposed or irresistible.” But this line of thought is riddled with fallacies.
Here’s a breakdown of the fallacious reasoning involved:
🧠 1. False Dilemma (Either/Or Fallacy)
- It assumes only two options: either grace is accepted by coercion (irresistibly), or any voluntary response is prideful.
- This ignores the possibility that one can humbly recognize their need and freely respond without claiming credit.
- It conflates acknowledging need with boasting in self. But recognizing one’s brokenness and receiving help is not pride—it’s the very definition of humility.
- As one writer put it, “Grace is not opposed to effort, it is opposed to earning.” Choosing to receive is not the same as earning.
- The argument assumes what it’s trying to prove: that any human response to grace must be prideful. But that’s precisely what’s under debate.
- It presupposes that divine sovereignty and human response are mutually exclusive, rather than complementary.
- It misrepresents the position of those who affirm human response by caricaturing it as self-exalting.
- In reality, many who affirm a responsive role in salvation emphasize that even the ability to respond is itself a gift of grace.
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My remarks that you highlighted are not fallacious. Since GWH and other FWers insist that God's grace is not efficacious, then they must tell come up with something that IS -- something that finally got them to ultimately "choose" Christ. And that "something" can only be their "freewill" that, of course, is in bondage to sin, the devil and the world. It is this "freewill" that parted their Red Sea that empowered them to cross over from Egypt (death) to eventually occupy the Promised Land (life).
You obviously don't understand very well Arminianism or Pelagianism. And for your info there is no such thing as "synergism", for in FWer's world when one rejects the gospel, it's the sinner that is to blame -- NOT God! (No "synergism" there!) Yet, at the same time when a sinner believes the gospel and repents, the sinner ultimately takes the credit since he believes that his eternal destiny also ultimately rests in his own hands, i.e. his "freewill" choice (so NO "synergism" here either). Synergism is just a nice sounding, polite ploy that pays lip service to God's saving grace while the sinner simultaneously pats himself on the back for being smarter, wiser, more pious, more religious, more spiritually savvy, whatever...for making a good decision.
You obviously don't understand very well Arminianism or Pelagianism. And for your info there is no such thing as "synergism", for in FWer's world when one rejects the gospel, it's the sinner that is to blame -- NOT God! (No "synergism" there!) Yet, at the same time when a sinner believes the gospel and repents, the sinner ultimately takes the credit since he believes that his eternal destiny also ultimately rests in his own hands, i.e. his "freewill" choice (so NO "synergism" here either). Synergism is just a nice sounding, polite ploy that pays lip service to God's saving grace while the sinner simultaneously pats himself on the back for being smarter, wiser, more pious, more religious, more spiritually savvy, whatever...for making a good decision.
IOW you disagree that your arguments are fallacious. No surprise there.
Neither is there any surprise in your assertion of monergism against the synergism many do believe in and of course would define differently than you do, but that takes us back to the lack of concern for making fallacious arguments.
Neither is there any surprise in your assertion of monergism against the synergism many do believe in and of course would define differently than you do, but that takes us back to the lack of concern for making fallacious arguments.
Synergism is a satanic scam that allows its adherents the luxury of self-righteousness, as they get to share in God's glory since the salvation buck stops with the ones doing the cooperating with God's ineffectual grace. Therefore, the ultimate cause, the ultimate determinant behind any sinner's salvation is the "freewill" of that sinner. You have already confessed previously that the difference between one sinner accepting the gospel truth and another rejecting it lays with the sinners themselves, and not God. So...where is your insipid synergism in such an admission!? You have never publicly given God 100% credit for the salvation of your soul. After all...God would never FORCE His will upon any sinner like he did with Adam, Abimelech, Balaam, Eli's two sons, Pharaoh, Cyrus and all those mentioned in the Parable of the Banquet (LK 14), etc.. In your universe, every man ultimately directs his own steps, his own ways, his own path, his own destiny -- all of which contradict scripture.
From "infancy" you say? You already had a good, loving heart from birth and didn't need a divine transplant, did you? You're MORE self-righteous than the rich young ruler who boasted about his righteousness from only boyhood (Lk 18:21). 
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It is you who mischaracterizes what I have written! I have never said man's faith is efficacious; but rather...(now try to pay really close attention!!!) since you FWer's do not see God's grace as being efficacious, then this must mean that the sinner's "freewill", the human faculty that has chosen to "cooperate" with God's grace and his gospel demands, must be what is efficacious! What else could it be!? You have a third option, do you? But since you won't be able to come up with another option, then the only logical inference to the Pelagian, Arminian or FWT heresies (whatever floats your boat) must be man's faculty of volition since man's will is the ultimate, final, authoritative and, therefore, efficacious arbiter and determinant of a sinner's eternal destiny. And you have already proven this FACT when you unequivocally denied that God makes the difference between one sinner who chooses to repent and believe the Gospel and another who chooses to reject the Gospel invitation. Your god is truly the "freewill" you think you have and used to choose your eternal destiny.
Also, I remind you once again that the heresy of Synergism cannot withstand the scrutiny of scripture. In fact, Synergism is a satanic lie -- a myth -- that has been foisted upon the minds and hearts of mankind. This is just another lie of the father of lies that the evil one uses to ask everyone..."Has God really said...?" But my answer to that question is YES! God really has asserted his sovereignty over his entire creation. God is running the universe and this world. He is in absolute control, no matter how much you despise the doctrine of God's sovereignty; for Synergism cannot get past these explicit and clear passages: Prov 16:1, 9, 33; 19:21; 20:24; 21:1; Isa 46:10; Jer 10:23; Dan 5:23; Act 4:23-28; Rom 9:14-18.
Even Prov 16:33 is very instructive in this doctrine of sovereignty because it teaches those of us, who have eyes to see and ears to hear, that there are no such things in this world as coincidences, luck, chance, fortune, randomness or arbitrariness. ALL is under God's providential control -- even something, as seemingly mundane, such as the roll of dice does not escape God's scrutiny or his eternal purposes.
Also, I remind you once again that the heresy of Synergism cannot withstand the scrutiny of scripture. In fact, Synergism is a satanic lie -- a myth -- that has been foisted upon the minds and hearts of mankind. This is just another lie of the father of lies that the evil one uses to ask everyone..."Has God really said...?" But my answer to that question is YES! God really has asserted his sovereignty over his entire creation. God is running the universe and this world. He is in absolute control, no matter how much you despise the doctrine of God's sovereignty; for Synergism cannot get past these explicit and clear passages: Prov 16:1, 9, 33; 19:21; 20:24; 21:1; Isa 46:10; Jer 10:23; Dan 5:23; Act 4:23-28; Rom 9:14-18.
Even Prov 16:33 is very instructive in this doctrine of sovereignty because it teaches those of us, who have eyes to see and ears to hear, that there are no such things in this world as coincidences, luck, chance, fortune, randomness or arbitrariness. ALL is under God's providential control -- even something, as seemingly mundane, such as the roll of dice does not escape God's scrutiny or his eternal purposes.